Market 540: Sprint Veloce 750E 01861 – numbers matching – assembly required

Update November 30, 2016:  This car exceeded estimates by a bit, selling for 151,200 Euros or $160,046.  Parity approaches!  I’m going to say this was a good deal for both parties to the sale.  The seller got more than they were expecting (if the estimates were no artificially low) and the buyer bought a car that will one day be a million euro’s if trends continue.

01861-ended

Thank you Marco Pestana for sending the link, and for keeping the vintage Alfa revs up in general!

October 19, 2016: Giulietta Sprint Veloce 750E 1495*01861, 1315*30052, 77052.  This early Sprint Veloce is being auctioned at the same time as Spider 00016 at Duemila Ruote November 27 – 29 2016, in Italy.  I bet some of you were expecting this write up today.

I have only had opportunity a few times to write about a project Alleggerita Sprint Veloce over the years – mostly because these have been expensive cars for a long time.  These were $100,000 cars when you could get a good original Sprint Speciale for less than $20,000, and buy a decent house in Oakland for $350,000.  Project in terms of a Sprint Veloce Alleggerita usually means raced half to death, rebuilt, raced half to death again, rebuilt again, over and over in what could be many cycles over many years.  It’s not uncommon for original engines to have gone missing, replaced hopefully by a Veloce block with a “near neighbor” VIN.  Also typically gone are the special lightweight seats and other bits that prove a challenge (satisfying challenge I imagine) to source.

front-right

When was the last time you saw a Sprint Veloce Alleggerita in this condition? Not you two guys – you have them in your garage – that’s not fair! The last and only one I recall is the burned out project in Southern California of a few years ago. Never heard whether it was a real one verified by numbers, or what happened to it. Anyone? This car looks pretty good! Once benefit of frequent racing is the heat cycles, care and track inspection requirements keep rust at bay. This thing will probably be in bare metal by Christmas.

rear-left

From the back we see some bumps and bruises, but nothing catasrophic. Check for replacement panel welds – catastrophic happens with regularity on the track. These look like the Heinbrand SZ wheels of 15 years ago – not sure if they’re still available. I used to have contact info for a place in the UK who would make you new plexi windows for your Alleggerita or helicopter.

interior-from-drivers-door

Interior is what you expect from a former race car, but honestly, a lot more of the original bits are there than you might think. Lots to do, lots to source, lots to scratch your head in wonder at. I would consider finding better placement for the fuel tank.

engine-from-right

Engine has been dropped in for easy transport, and has all the modifications one expects of a race car. Headers, open intake pointed up to catch anything that happens to enter the engine compartment and break the engine in an attempt to consume it. Interesting this was raced with 40DCO3’s. I am going to guess that the block on the pallet is the original matching number one.

bertone-number-77052

Bertone number as expected. This early in production it’s probably not uncommon for the engine serial number to match the Bertone number, but this is not required for it to be matching number.

build-plate-01861

Build plate looks original to me. This is what ties all the numbers together.

engine-30052

Engine number stamping looks correct to me. Buyer should assume this block will require some skilled reconstruction.

I think the Sprint Veloce Alleggerita is my favorite of the Giuliettas. I would happily work on this as my sole Giulietta project for many years. Anyone have $150K I can borrow? Or is that $250K? We’ll know in a month.

Advertisements

15 thoughts on “Market 540: Sprint Veloce 750E 01861 – numbers matching – assembly required

  1. It is rare to have the chassis’s last two numbers match the last to the Bertone number. Good to see the original parts are still there. To find the missing parts is a long term affair and not for the person who may have a thin wallet. The cost of these cars is getting up in the price range where only the wealthy can participate any more.
    Thank you for posting this car and glad to have you back on board with the newsletters. I have added a couple more cars to the register’s.

  2. Here is what the Sprint Veloce Register has listed for this car. This was from a source someone gave me years ago. Looks to be the first owner as I have no other updates on the car. “ALFRANCO PAGANI, MILANO”

  3. Hi Matt

    Lightweight 1493E*01861 with engine 1315*30052 was built in Rosso Alfa (AR 501 Bertone Red) and sold on 16.05.1956 to Attranco Pagani in MiIano. (info from that notorious document “la prima 100 Giulietta Sprint Veloce).

    Yes it was common on the first 150-ish cars for the engine numbers to match the Bertone Body numbers as only the Lightweights were designated 77xxx and only the 750 Veloce’s used the 30xxx engine numbers – this fell out of sequence when Spider Veloce’s started drawing engines from the production line and replacement engines were needed for the odd problem & Hughes & De Prato noted in “The Racing Veloce’s” that engines which delivered above average HP on the dyno were set aside for ‘special customers’

    I make the repro lightweight tubular seats, I’ve just re-made the correct speedo drive gears for the tunnel case box when paired with the 4.1 rear axle ratio + a few other bits. Stuart Passey (Lightweight E04700) has re-made the aluminium section for the window frames. Between Alfastop, Classic Alfa, Hein Brand, OPK, Afra etc, repro aluminium bumpers, headlight rings, eyebrows etc are available

    Lightweight 1493E*04288, Bertone number 77460 – the burned one sold in LA a few years ago is being restored.

    The good news is that this one was previously unknown to us, so another survivor surfaces !!

    Ciao
    Greig

    Keeper of the Lightweight Register
    Keeper of the Confortevole Register

    • Greig,

      Good to hear from you.

      I think as time goes on we will all be surprised by the number of survivors there are among these cars. There are probably 10 SS’s on the market at the moment I don’t have in my registers, and there are already way over what many people thought the number would be captured in those registers by my half-assed record keeping snap shot of the last 8 years.

      Of course even more interesting will be sorting out the duplicates of really valuable cars.

      How many lightweights do you have listed these days?

      Ciao,
      Matt

  4. Strange stamping of *77052 * from behind the panel with raised font rather than stamped into
    the panel. That looks odd. I had 2 lightweights & do not remember that, anyone with one to compare & comment.

  5. 48 positively identified cars with chassis numbers, 12 unknown chassis numbers from various places = 60 cars out of 600 or 10%…… there are still more out there, I’d appreciate any and all info on any Lightweight or Confortevole anyone has, also pictures – Matt has my contact details

    Ciao
    Greig

  6. I was at the Duemila and looked at the car with an Italian friend who races and works full time restoring cars. He told me not to bid as there were too many hard to find pieces missing. He had tried to restore one exactly like it a few years earlier for a client and they stopped the project because they were fabricating everything. That said, it was an honest car. No rust and every bit of the body was solid. Best of luck to the buyer as I also wanted this one but didn’t have the guts.

  7. Well I have the sliding widow door frame section for the new owner but, as Jim says, there are so many difficult parts to find that one ends up having to make them and that starts to really cost. My estimation, for what it’s worth, is that the sale price is probably half the total costs which chimes in with the last Lightweight sold through Conrad for $310k as I recall.

  8. A.R. Giulietta Sprint Veloce alleggerita (Duemilaruote: pro & contro)
    (AR1493E*01861*/77052/AR1315*30052*)
    Everybody well knows the often significant differences existing by watching the same object in picture and live. I was there, personally, for the preview first and then for the auction. I examined the car we are writing about in every detail for hours (I can deliver a lot of images, if needed) and I would list the following considerations:
    For (pro): chassis and Bertone VIN numbers are genuine, originally and correctly imprinted (from the right side), the car is the # 47 built in ’56 (the engine, not the chassis, and Bertone last two numbers are matching just for coincidence, a casualty, I believe. Any real planned rationale reason for this. Otherwise, statistically, we should have the majority and not just few of those singular situations); the engine on the pallet seems to be its original one (to be for sure completely rebuilt); the head on the wrong (and frontally broken) basement installed in the car is right; tween Weber 40DCO3 are ok; oil cup ok; aluminium (Al) and perspex are were they are supposed to be; instruments are ok; pedals ok; electrical system (a mass) apparently ok; IPRA warmer ok; rear plate original or so. Furthermore, in a hangar, inside several cardboard boxes and on the floor, I saw the following original and peculiar parts, of course in almost piteous conditions: seats complete but with covers very different from the original shape, material and colour, 2 + 2 door sliding plexi windows and their Al frames, increased capacity fuel tank, IPRA radiator, bumpers (made in iron – not original for Veloce – instead Al), front (with their Al frames) and rear lights, two rear axle shafts, driveshaft, the rare air filter box, windscreen wipers, front plate (remade), still intact inside rear mirror, other engine parts i.e. front cover, plastic instead metal fan, chain and other small parts. The front typical A.R. shield results flattened as a sheet of paper… : who can guess why….?
    Against (contro): chassis, used-destroyed-rebuild-reused-redestroyed (it is unknown how many times…) in racing MUST be completely dismantled and rebuild; front fenders and doors completely creased, it seems they have been rolled into a ball like a A4 sheet of paper and then stretched out again (difficult to understand what happened), trunk has been severely modified inside for housing the new Al security fuel tank, also battery and its support has changed their usual location so, MUST be completely reconstruct, a lot of bolsters have been adopted (4 bases of roll-bar, bottoms of both front and rear fenders, many welding and connections result to be made in a very hasty and awful way, it seems in a hurry, without any attention, it is possible parts are not corresponding (matching) properly, difficult to see by naked eye but it is likely, rudimental front brake aerators in Al has been made and attached in some way etc, etc. How is the area under chassis? We could imagine….
    I also was there with a couple of friends having years of experience in classic cars, A.R. cars and, specifically, Giulietta and Sprint alleggerita cars, members of the Technical Commission of ASI and RIAR: they estimated 150-180k € of manpower, plus all the parts that must be substituted (i.e. all rubber seals have to be new, carpets, sky,…) and free of all the problems and inconveniences that, for sure, will raise-up to bring that unit, after months if not years, back to the original technical specifications of mechanic and chassis shape. I think we can not use the “restoration” word for this car but it must be completely “rebuild”, with a lot (the majority?) of new made and very expansive parts; so, at the end, it will be very nice but it will be another car.
    My final opinion is that the auction in general, as system to sell stuff, must be banish, by law. It is among the best way to steal money, to sell an object that can not have intrinsic value higher than 10 €/$/£ to even 100,000 or more. So, I see auctions as a legalized theft that dramatically alter the market. Can you imagine people who own a Veloce in decent fair or even nice conditions, running, 90% original, preserved or conservatively restored only few years ago, who until yesterday thought to sell it for 150.000-200.000 € (already an overstated price) how much he will go to ask after that wreck has been sold for 160.000 €?!?! This, in my modest point of view, is the main reason why the price of this version of Giulietta is exponentially growing, hopefully it stops one day: not only because not too many have been built in the ‘50s but because the majority has been used for racing, their natural purpose and destiny, destroyed (or almost) for the same reason; the few survived need a lot of time and money to be restored. Who does this job, of course, wonts its money back plus an obvious benefit and finally you obtain the present prices for the Giulietta Sprint Veloce allegerita. At the end, if you check well, you will discover that even your wallet will be much more lightened. Good luck and many wishes for the next Season’s Greetings to everybody!
    Roberto

  9. I was also present at the auction and spend a lot of time looking at the car. Rear fenders really looked to be in bad shape (multiple repairs). When looking at the overall condition I was subject to think that the front and front fenders were looking too good compared to the rest of the body and had likely been changed after some severe collision damage. The vin, engine and bertone Numbers looked correct/genuine … but still with a replica 250 SWB and California spider body shell and a restamped 1600 GT to GTA chassis being sold as part of same collection … how can one be 100 % sure? Also without having seen the libretto/papers and any documentation, the new buyer has taken some risks… Unless (s)he knows more of the history. When checking some of my records, it seems that Pagani, the first owner, did participate in the 56 MM … but with a Fiat and not with an Alfa and in 57 with Alfa but a spider veloce and not the SV. Was the SV not ready for 56 MM or already damaged in practice? Finally Pagani did drive the 1000 km of the Nurnburgring in 56 with an SV … would this be the very same car? Would anybody have access to the records of the german race? Is there anything more known on the history? Does anybody knows whom bought the car (hopefully not just an investor but true enthousiast)?
    Finally I think that it is very much a car worth being restored to its former glory, but when looking back at the sales results, the 6C aerolux, 6C Freccia d’oro or even the alfa indicar were sold for a much better deal to their new Alfa lover.

    • I wonder you saw rear fenders “really looked to be in bad shape”: there were not new, of course…, but in my view, as in general it happens, they were the finest part of the entire car…! Rear fenders did not look to have been substituted. On the contrary, probably, the front side has been changed or repaired, not too much accurately, (still now needs a severe repair) compared to the rest of the body for the racing reasons you mentioned. Quite normal for a racing car, may be in the hands of a not properly top driver… I fully agree concerning VIN and related considerations: you can never be 100% sure even but, at least in this case, after seen the car live it could be defined genuine. A replica in those years did not have had any sense whereas if done more recently the car could not be already reduced in that dramatic conditions. Just suppositions. We also do not know if the car has been used only by Pagani; anyway, you reported correctly about his participations and, it is also correct, for the ’56 MM (28-29 April) the car, built on 16 May, was not ready yet…. (I was not there, but the CDS A.R. certifies this). Anyway, we do not have to think only at the main competitions (MM, Targa Florio, Nurburgring, Coupe des Alpes, Rally Montecarlo and so on); during those years there were tents of minor race, more than one every single Sunday, to which driver participated trying to get a bit of glory winning a cup or just for a workout. At present, I do not know who is the unlucky buyer (by phone) of the car we are talking about for that incredible amount of money. People working every day in that field and A.R. expert told me that at least other 150-180k € could be needed to bring back the car on the road running fine and in nice general conditions, I mean accomplishing the original A.R. specifications. Making a simple calculation we can easily understand why the GSprV “alleggerita” that, generally, are found more or less in those conditions of mechanic and body, are sold, fully restored (this is another chapter to be analysed….), for around 300k €. In any case, after the full remake (but really full, complete!), after many parts will be substituted, many accessories changed or completely rebuilt, the car will not the same as it born anymore. It will be another car with the same name which will cost as a Ferrari or almost like an SZ or a GTA; GSprV “alleggerita” is among the few models which value is sailing significantly out of the highest prices reported by the specialized press for classic/historic cars. We have to wait just a couple of years, may be less, and we will see this car back again, completely restored we will not know by who and how, for sale, at six digits price of which the first one will be 3 if not 4…. Is not a hocus-pocus but a great market speculation. Until when? Who knows. Finally, going back to the original sentence: for sure the seller (Italian government) got much, much more than expected (how could estimates be artificially lowered, did you see the object conditions?), really a very big deal! Regarding the buyer I am not sure if he/she already realized what he purchased…..!

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s